Flat-Track Dolls vs. Banked-Track Queens...Which Are Best?

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Permalink Reply by Michi-chan on February 9, 2008 at 10:24pm

I don't think that comparing banked vs. flat track deserves an analogy such as comparing playing football on the street vs. on a field. While the costs and technicalities involved with finding a venue and building a banked track is much higher than the flat track, I personally prefer the flat track game.

As a fan of derby and a journalist, I find the flat track game a much more intimate experience. All 6 leagues I cover are flat track. Two are WFTDA members, one is a junior league, one is "no-holds barred" and one is minimal rules. The fans here like the flat track derby because the action is right in front of them and they can get more involved in the action. You don't have to sit fans in elevated seats in order to see anything and fans can be more involved (such as coming to the trackline after a bout and contgratulating the winning team).

Now I am not saying that there is no place for banked track. I watched some video of San Diego scrimmaging on "Greenie" for a television interview and the one jammer on there was sure picking up speed. Speed is only one aspect of the sport. The fan interaction is very important. I just think flat track does a better job in that department.

If a banked track league was to form in Arizona, I would support them and cover them on the Arizona Derby Report, but at the same time, I would not abandon flat track.

with derby love...
Michi-chan
=m
http://www.michichan.com

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Permalink Reply by Grand Poobah on February 10, 2008 at 1:57am

Just speaking for myself here:

I'm not opposed to banked track derby, I just don't feel that there's a great business case for it.

They are different versions of a sport with the same basic idea.

I'm sure I'm not exactly preaching to the choir here, but I think that the lower cost structure of flat track derby allows for some great stuff.

Travel bouts: This is flat track derby's money sink. Rather than pay 20K for the track, rent a pricey practice space and/or rent a venue (for considerably longer than a flat track league because the track would need to be built), a tractor trailer to haul the track around in, they can travel around playing the best players from leagues near and far. They can fly in other leagues to play against them. There are more than 100 leagues to choose to play against, 50 or so within the WFTDA alone. I suspect there could be about ten flat track tournaments with established leagues around the country this year. I believe two of them play one another regularly (neighboring sister organizations) and one or both plays the other better-known league maybe once per year.

Player ownership: Nearly every one of the flat track league is owned and managed by the players. I can off the top of my head think of perhaps three player-owned banked track leagues. I wouldn't know (I wasn't there) but I've heard many of the old school banked track players bemoan what the owners did to the game. League management can react better to the players' wants and needs because the leaders are generally the players themselves. The owner and management isn't whoever could afford to buy/build/store the track.

Competition: When there's 150ish leagues in the U.S. to play against (1/3 of them in the same association), nearly all of them using a standardized rules set, this allows them to pick fairly competitive opponents to play against who are playing the game by the same rules that they do.

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Permalink Reply by Marc Stern, The Chicago Ace on February 10, 2008 at 10:00am

While I love the talent of the WFTDA women, especially The Windy City Rollers, the game they play is an offensive game. They have rules and penalties you just cannot figure out and they have shoulder blocking as their basic block. The WFTDA rules are so confusing that they are on version two point something and the skaters and the referees are STILL not clear on how to call, enforrce or even understand the rules. And as for being a spectator you get 4 minors and THEN the skaters go to the penalty box and you never know when that is AND the penalty can happen so that the two teams have THEIR JAMMERS in the box!?!? The OSDA is definitely THE GAME with the most connection to the past. The Pivot skater can just break out after an opposing jammer whereas in the other league you have to pass your helmet cover. They also do A LOT more blocking and it is truly an offensive and defensive game like it should be. And as soon as the rule is broken to the penalty box you go. Faster and easier to follow. As for comparing to the Banked Track veterans of old? Kind of hard to do, I think the most Veteran rollergirl has MAYBE 40 games under her belt in 4 years. The Derby skaters, had 40 training school games under her belt in two months. The new girls do have heart, talent and skill but to compare them to the well trained skaters of RollerGames and Roller Derby is unfair.

Marc Stern
THE Chicago Ace

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Permalink Reply by Grand Poobah on February 11, 2008 at 9:43pm

Both jammers in the box is not allowed under WFTDA rules. When it happens the jam stops immediately, they hand over their jammer covers to other players who are on the track, and a new jam starts with the same lineup. When the two former jammers' minutes expires, they re-enter as blockers. Fairly simple and obvious approach.

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Permalink Reply by Maschine on February 21, 2008 at 5:51am

Under the pre WFTDA 2.1 rules both Jammers would sit in the box during the running jam. I saw that happen in a Gotham Girls game and was shocked. That was fixed though in the updated rules, which is cool.

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Permalink Reply by anonymous rollergirl on February 23, 2008 at 10:47pm

I just wanted to clarify this generalization that WFTDA is primarily an offensive game and that there is not much blocking (based on his statement that OSDA does "A LOT more blocking.") I've seen this idea floating around out there before, that flat track derby, WFTDA rules, or whatever, is not defensive enough, and I think that's crazy.

In my opinion as a skater with a WFTDA league, and as someone who has seen probably upwards of 20 different flat track leagues skate in both intraleague and interleague bouts and tournaments, nothing is more obvious than the fact that you can't generalize about the defensive/blocking ability of the entire WFTDA and greater flat track community. The best predictor of a league's defensive/blocking skills is not the fact that it's flat track, but rather, it's the age of the league. (Keep in mind the age of the entire flat track community is still very young. The most experienced leagues are still only 4-7 years old, and the majority of leagues are even younger.) The longer a league has been around, the better their defensive skills tend to be. So, if the only flat track derby you have seen is a new start-up league that is still learning the ropes, you will not see as strong defense as you will see if you attend WFTDA tournaments and see the top teams compete for the championship. If you follow flat track scores, you'll see this reflected in the higher scores of the bouts between newer leagues, vs the lower scores in bouts between more experienced leagues.

As the flat track leagues get more and more experienced every year, the defense is only going to continue to grow stronger, as it is already doing.

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Permalink Reply by Al on February 15, 2008 at 7:16pm

Definately prefer banked track...Just my opinion and their you have it....I know in Philly Ms. Judy Sowinski and Mr. Arnold "Skip" Schoen have a great flat track gig going on there....I bet if they brought the bank track back to Philly it would be a blast. Thanks, Al

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Permalink Reply by Father James on February 18, 2008 at 10:39am

I have to agree. But me personally. I prefer the banked track. I always will. I grew up with the banked track. I know the last few years there was a push for all girl leagues. While the puritans believe that it should be unisex like it was in the original leagues. I am all for that. Now back to flat versus banked. Honestly they both have a place.. I just prefer Banked over flat. And always will. I just hope that helps.

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Permalink Reply by Al on February 18, 2008 at 10:53am

Amen Rev. :-)

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Permalink Reply by Jim Fitzpatrick on February 18, 2008 at 9:22pm

Learning to master a banked track is an art in itself. The track allows skaters to reach much higher speeds than skatars who race on flat tracks. This is also why bike tracks and race car tracks are banked. Tracks, if constructed properly, will have some give to them, allowing a skater to attempt more high risk maneuvers. The only time you've ever seen skaters attempting flying jump blocks and take downs on a flat track was in Japan when the skaters were padded up like hockey players. Other than that, a skater would risk gaurenteed injury. People want to see an extreme game with high flying jump blocks, take downs, etc. Top skaters are highly competitive and want to push the envelope. Just viewing one of David Sam's videos in which Ray Robles performs a screamer on Tony Trijillo tells it all. High impact of that extreme would not be attempted on a flat track.

Another issure is without a track, a team is really at the mercy of the officiating. I've seen quite a bit of flat track footage where skaters make contact with the infield and yet are still awarded points. With a banked track, the playing field is much more clearly defined and it's more obvious when a skater's skate makes contact with the infield. And on the outside, the rails and kick rails do their job helping keep a skater in the playing field.

I do feel, top flat track skaters can adapt to the banked track with proper training. Also, once anyone tries a banked track, they never want to go back! As mentioned earlier by another, the track is an expense, but it's well worth it.

Jim Fitzpatrick
GM, SF Bay Bombers

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Permalink Reply by Father James on February 19, 2008 at 8:31am

I totally agree with you there Mr. Fitzpatrick. I still want to skate the old RG track with the old wall of death and the jump ramp.

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Permalink Reply by Jersey Joe on February 21, 2008 at 9:47am

Amen to that! Once you go banked, you'll never go back!
There's just nothing like it.

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